Erin Foster Is Working on ‘Nobody Wants This’ Season 2 — and She Has Ideas for Season 3
[This story contains spoilers from the season one finale of Nobody Wants This.]
“So, how does this work?” Erin Foster is already working on that answer.
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The first season of her Jewish rom-com Nobody Wants This followed “hot rabbi” Noah (Adam Brody) and agnostic podcaster Joanne (Kristen Bell) falling in love — despite the obstacles, religious and otherwise. For Joanne, that included getting over her “ick” factor and winning over Noah’s “perfect ex” fan club. But Noah is in line to become the head rabbi at his Los Angeles synagogue, which makes marrying someone like Joanne, who isn’t Jewish, the biggest complication. By the end of their 10-episode courtship, Joanne decides to convert to Judaism for Noah, only to backtrack in the final moments of the season. But just when you think they are parting ways, Noah shows up and chooses her.
What does this mean for his lifelong rabbinical aspirations? What will his very opinionated Jewish family have to say? And, how will they navigate all of this as a couple?
Everyone is now asking those questions, and everyone is going to get those answers, eventually. They’re just going to have to wait until Rosh Hashanah next year.
“We’ve been in the writers room for about three weeks now,” Foster tells The Hollywood Reporter, speaking after Netflix officially announced season two on Oct. 10, just two weeks after the show released. “Kristen [Bell] came into the room with Justine [Lupe, who plays Morgan] to hear some storylines that we were working on. And she says she hasn’t gotten a reaction to anything like this, literally, since Frozen.”
Nobody Wants This has sparked for viewers around the globe, racking up millions of viewership hours and spawning think pieces and “hot rabbi” memes since its Sept. 26 debut. Foster, the podcaster daughter of music producer David Foster and Rebecca Dyer (who hosts The World’s First Podcast with her sister and executive producer Sara Foster, also her partner in fashion line Favorite Daughter), wrote Nobody Wants This based on her own life. Foster converted to Judaism and married her husband Simon Tikhman; they now have a 5-month-old daughter.
Below, the creator spills on the changes that are in store for season two — making it clear what’s not in reaction to criticism — and says she knows what viewers want as she talks about her long-term plan: “Joanne does not have to have the same journey that I had. But, I don’t think this is the kind of show to rob the audience of what they want to see. I think this is a show where you want to get what you want.” She also reflects on a show about Judaism being so popular amid a surge in antisemitism, shares how Netflix knew they had a hit before the show even released and reveals whether or not Brody has seen any of the memes.
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What kind of a response have you gotten from your Jewish community. Have you been bombarded at synagogue over the Jewish High Holidays? [Editor’s note: We spoke ahead of Yom Kippur, on Oct. 11, one day after the season two renewal was announced.]
The response has been awesome. I haven’t been to temple since the show came out. [Her husband] Simon went to temple for Rosh Hashanah. He went to the daytime service alone. He and his parents are going to services [for Yom Kippur] and I’m staying home with the baby. So, hopefully they get bombarded.
I actually should throw myself into some really Jewish environments while this is happening, just to get some attention.
And some material for season two.
Literally.
You may be responsible for helping to convert people to Judaism. To borrow a line from your finale — in the conversation between Rebecca (Emily Arlook) and Joanne (Bell) — how are you handling this Jewish pressure?
I enjoy it. It’s interesting. I was talking to my mom about this. My mom went to the Nova exhibit [honoring victims of the Oct. 7 terror attack] on Thursday night, and my mom now thinks she’s a celebrity, because she has people coming up to her talking about the show. My mom really feels like she has a Jewish soul, and she keeps threatening to convert. So after the show she’s like, “I really think I should follow through with this.” And I’m like, “Ok mom, go ahead. Do it.”
On the flip side, I’ve seen you speak about how private your husband is and the anxiety you had for your marriage when the show was coming out. Now that you’ve been renewed, what’s his reaction to another season?
I intentionally made season one so different from our real life and our real story, so we were protected from that. His parents watched the show, and they didn’t see much of themselves in the characters. You have to take creative license. Not only because it’s a TV show, but to pull away from the real characters. Also, there’s not enough conflict in my real life. My in-laws, unfortunately, are very nice to me, so there’s no fun material to mine from that. I think I’ve been threading the needle perfectly, so far.
Could you assign a percentage of how much was pulled from your life?
That’s a good question. The emotional themes of the show are really, really accurate to my real experience. It’s just that the situations aren’t the same. I did feel a sense of being an outsider coming into my relationship with my husband in a way that I didn’t anticipate. I grew up with so many Jewish friends, and I never felt like there was a separation or a difference. There was no highlighted position that I was in as a non-Jewish person. I would go to my friend’s Rosh Hashanah dinners with their families, and so that [feeling] really wasn’t a factor in my life.
So when I started dating Simon, and I learned the difference with immigrant parents and how they feel about Judaism, I was sort of confused. I was like, “Why am I feeling like I’m this wrong-side-of-the-tracks person in your life, because I’ve never felt like that before?” I think I didn’t have an appreciation for the experience of immigrants coming here and the weight that being Jewish carries for them, and the importance of continuing a Jewish lineage. I was just learning as I went along, and it was fascinating. I can look back on it in hindsight with the ability to create something from it. But in the moment, it was very intimidating.
I read that the “ick” scene was ripped from your real life, and that Simon similarly brought a large bouquet of sunflowers when first meeting your parents. When it comes to your courtship with Simon and how Noah and Joanne’s romance plays out, what was off limits?
The moment in “The Ick” [episode] when Noah pulls Joanne aside and says, “You gotta stop this. We like each other. Get your shit together,” that was a real moment that happened with me and Simon. And it wasn’t from the flowers, necessarily, it was just different things that were happening that made me feel like, “This guy is too emotionally available. He’s too into me and he’s not playing any games, and this just feels like it’s not for me. I don’t think this person can handle me, because he’s too pure. That can’t possibly be a guy that’s going to keep up with me.”
And when I pulled away, because I was spooked by that, instead of him grabbing on tighter and panicking — like we do as human beings when we feel someone pulling away, we spiral and become even less appealing — instead of doing that, he really stood in himself. He stood strong and was very unwavering. He was like, “I see what you’re doing. I need you to take a beat. I’m not going anywhere. And when you’re ready to stop this spinning out that you’re doing, I’ll be right here; you know where to find me.” It just woke me up. I was 35 years old and hadn’t had anyone have that conversation with me.
When you’re creating something, you don’t know what the reaction is going to be in the moment. When you’re fighting for something to be there [in the show], you don’t know if you are on an island. Like, maybe that moment was only meaningful to me because it happened to me? And so when I was fighting to get that moment in [the show] and fighting for things not to get cut — I was like, “This feels important. I need her to turn around and not be able to look at him when she’s feeling vulnerable. These are things that I feel connected to and I need to see them.” You don’t know if that’s going to come out and no one gets it. So when it came out and everybody gets it — they’re like, “Ugh, this is me. That’s an experience I’ve had” or, “That’s an experience I would want to have” — that’s the most validating thing.
I think my experience is a universal experience. That’s the thing you want to walk into as a writer. You want the audience to be experiencing it as if they were experiencing it themselves, that’s the goal.
So, Nobody Wants This released and quickly ascended to the very top of Netflix and hung out there for a while.
Until Love Is Blind came back. Honestly, I participated in that, because I’m watching Love is Blind.
It had a long run as No. 1. In this current climate of surging antisemitism, your Jewish rom-com is the most popular show. What do you make of that? I know when you went through the process of converting to Judaism, you were asked if you were really ready to be Jewish and experience everything that comes with that, including antisemitism.
It’s an interesting social experiment. I’ve said this before, but when I was doing the final steps of converting and was asked if I was ready to be hated, ready to have antisemitism put in my face, I didn’t know what I was signing up for. Because at the time, it was 2019 and those conversations were not as prominent as they are today, or as they even were in 2020. I said yes to something that I didn’t even really understand. It took me being Jewish while antisemitism was having such a surge, and is having such a surge, to really understand what that meant. And nothing has made me feel more Jewish than experiencing it like this today.
There are tens of millions of people watching the show, and loving the show. And loving Adam Brody as a rabbi and loving the little tidbits of Judaism that you learn about. Those, statistically, have to be some of the people who are supporting certain agendas that are anti-Jewish. And I don’t even think they know that’s what they are doing, clearly, if they are loving the show. So I think there is a lot of hypocrisy going on. If there can be any people who watch and this show makes them maybe second guess something that they reposted that they didn’t understand, and for them to clock the amount of people they may have hurt, or that maybe they just don’t know enough about the thing that they are talking about, I hope that can happen. Because these people who are loving the show have to love some aspect of Judaism. So, the numbers aren’t making sense.
I read that many places turned you down when you pitched this show, before you got to Netflix.
Hulu, Apple, FX. Others could have passed on even hearing the pitch, too.
By the time the season two renewal came down, Nobody Wants This had racked up almost 90 million hours of viewing worldwide. When did your conversations start with Netflix about a second season?
They were getting early data before the show came out. They have lots of different ways where they test how a show is going to do. They do internal screenings, they have screeners that get sent out to certain subscribers. And they had a really high number of people completing the series. Even internally in the Netflix group, globally, there are employees who get early access. And they were like, “We’re seeing this completion rate that’s really high.” It’s sort of a microcosm of what happens outside those offices. So I was feeling pretty good going into it. But, how could I ever have imagined it would be like this? I just couldn’t.
As soon as it came out, and it was quickly doing well, I couldn’t imagine a world where they weren’t going to give us a season two. But even as far as [the week of Oct. 7, before the renewal announcement], the Netflix executives came into the writers room and I was like, “When are we announcing season two?” And they were like, “We can’t really tell you.” And I was like, “Well, we’re in the writers room…”
So, you have already had the writers room up for season two?
Yeah, we’ve had the room up for about three weeks. They greenlit a second season writers room before a second season production. Those are two different things. This is part of what the writers strike was about [protections for pre-greenlight rooms during the development process], where sometimes rooms would get a greenlight without seasons. But this kind of made it more fun. It stretches out the process of getting the green light.
Well when you wrote the first season, you obviously didn’t know any of this yet. And you ended season one on a major cliffhanger. Were you prepared to accept this “So, how does this work?” ending between Noah and Joanne if the show had ended in this way?
Never knowing? I kind of always operated with the hope of a season two. When you’re on set and you’re in editing and experiencing it, the chemistry between Adam and Kirsten was palpable. You’d watch on screen and we felt like, “Oh, we think we struck something that’s really special here.” So I guess I kind of always looked at the show in editing with the idea of, “Where would we take it next, if we could?”
Have you thought about a long-term game plan? Are you thinking three seasons, five… seven? Is there a number?
I’d like to be employed as long as possible, I guess. There are a lot of stories to tell. It’s funny because, we’ve been in the writers room and so we’re working on storylines, and we keep coming up with storylines and being like, “That’s for season three. That’s for season three.” And we’re like, “Should we just make a board and pitch out season three to them at the same time?” Because, we have ideas.
Something that ended up being special about the show, that I really have to give Netflix credit for pushing us to do, was to let the story unfold really slowly in season one. Initially, when I developed the idea, I had seen [Noah and Joanne] getting engaged or married by the finale of season one, and when we got into the writing process Netflix kept being like, “Slow it down, slow it down. We don’t want to get there too quickly.” And it ended up being really great storytelling, because it makes you feel like you’re experiencing the relationship in real time. You can watch a show and have these manufactured time jumps, where you don’t really experience the minutia of how a relationship unfolds, and so we were really able to do that.
So in thinking of season two, I don’t want to break that system that we have in place. I think we’ll pick up mostly more or less where we left off. Not the same night, but the same moment of, “So, what now? How do we do this?”
In your real life, you converted to Judiasm. Are we supposed to take that as a spoiler, or could Joanne’s path be different?
Joanne does not have to have the same journey that I had in real life. We always use my experiences as a template to jump off of, if it works and if the room really responds to it. But she’s her own person. She has her own story, for sure. So, I don’t know. It could go either way. But also, I don’t think this is the kind of show to make artistic choices that rob the audience of what they want to see. I think this is a show where you want to get what you want; you don’t want to be fucked with. I’m not trying to dangle things and not give them to people.
You’ve weighed in on some of the criticism around the show. (There have been essays on the “shiksa goddess” trope, and criticism about Jewish stereotypes and how the Jewish women were portrayed.) You’ve said these aren’t Jewish stereotypes, they’re comedy stereotypes. Can you talk about the Jewish make up of your writers room and, what were some of the big discussions around season one and/or lessons learned that you’re bringing into season two?
There were a lot of Jewish writers season one. We had a real mish-mosh of people who had converted to Judaism as adults, people who grew up Jewish, people who were Jewish but had spouses who were not Jewish, people who grew up in more conservative households or less conservative households. And really, the irony is that it was typically Jewish writers who were saying, “Let me make sure the parents feel like real Jewish parents.” I think it’s sort of you’re damned if you do, you’re damned if you don’t. Because if you go against stereotype then you’ll be accused of not knowing how to write Jewish characters. And if you go towards stereotypes, I guess people are going to be upset about that as well.
But I think if you look at the show as a whole, a lot of the criticism wants to ignore that we have a female rabbi [played by Leslie Grossman] who is really accepting of Joanne. We also have a lot of really flawed characters who are not Jewish; Joanne is a really flawed character. There’s this hyper focus on the female Jewish characters being stereotypes, but there’s a real lack of acknowledgment about how strong they are as women, and how they’re the matriarchs of the family. They’re not these passive housewives who don’t have opinions and or a say in their family. They’re the authoritarian in their relationship in a way that’s cool.
Esther [played by Jackie Tohn] is a really loyal friend to Rebecca, that’s why she doesn’t like Joanne. Not because Joanne isn’t Jewish. She doesn’t give a shit. She’s loyal to her friend Rebecca. So, we’re going to continue telling the story in season two and fleshing those characters out as we always planned to do, and not as a reaction to criticism. Because I think the majority of people see that this is a net-positive for Jewish people in general.
We saw both Esther and Rebecca evolve by the finale, so I was going to ask how you plan to flesh them out more in season two. Will they play as big of roles?
Yeah. We’re still playing around with the different stories. Esther for sure, is going to be a regular in season two. We love Jackie, she is such a fun actress. And she really gave Esther some fun, nuanced stuff. Like in episode two when she pulls up to the bar and she’s saying, “Whore No. 1” and “Whore No. 2” and she’s screaming, “Get the fuck in the car.” And then she’s like [to her husband Sasha, played by Timothy Simons], “Hi honey! OK, 4-3-2-1.” That’s a choice Jackie made that was really fun. Like, I act mad at my husband, but then we actually have a cute, sweet relationship. So I’m excited to see what she does with everything we give her in season two.
And the Rebecca character was always something I was really passionate about. While maybe someone criticizing her could see a girl who is obsessed with getting married, and that being a Jewish stereotype, that wasn’t the intention. The intention behind her was actually a sweet, beautiful, wonderful, educated, perfect-on-paper Jewish girl that your parents would love for you to be with. And, that you should be with, in a lot of ways, because your life makes sense together. And you know exactly what your life would look like if you were with that girl, and it would be a great life. But something doesn’t feel right, and you don’t know what it is. I love the idea of a perfect ex-girlfriend haunting your current relationship. Every woman can relate to having an obsession with the ex, and especially if she’s perfect on paper. And that’s really where the inspiration came from with Rebecca.
You do learn so much more about her in the finale. You understand her struggle more and empathize with who she is. So we’re going to continue doing that. We’re not going to write for a reaction to criticism.
You brought in new showrunners for season two — Jenni Konner and Bruce Eric Kaplan, as well as EP Nora Silver. [Foster was co-showrunner on season one with Jack Burdit.] What they will bring to the show and why the change?
I just feel so lucky to have Jenni, Bruce and Nora, because I’m a huge Girls fan. I loved Girls. I saw Tiny Furniture before Lena [Dunham] then went on to make Girls. I am a huge fan of their taste level. With season one, we had a wild rush of scripts. We had the writers strike in the middle of our writers room. It became super chaotic. We lost writers in the process. It wasn’t unprecedented, because it’s happened before, but it was a challenging thing to throw into the middle of everything. For season two, we just needed a new process, and we needed to figure out what that looked like. I really needed to focus on being the voice of the show, and the writing. Being showrunner is like the job of 10 people, so I was so excited to have them come in and help make sure that the creative stays hyper-focused, and that I can be in my lane. They’ve been great. I just got really lucky. It’s been great in the room, to just have people there whose taste I love and to have a really good process. And I get to hear all the behind-the-scenes Girls stories.
You previously said you auditioned “every hot Jewish actor in town” for Noah. Who was runner-up or who came close to Adam Brody?
Mmm, great question. There wasn’t a close second. I want to give a more fun answer, but no one had the warmth that Adam had, and the charm and confidence. That sweet boy next door, but someone who can also tell you to put your ice cream down [in the first kiss scene]. It was just him.
Another big piece of criticism from viewers is that they want more, or longer, episodes next season. Is that anything you are pushing for?
(Laughs) I would love that. That’s so funny. I’m pretty sure we’re only getting 10 episodes, which seems like a full season to me. I think it’s always better leaving people asking for more, instead of people wishing that there were less. If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it. But longer episodes [thinking], I don’t know about. Because, they were really short. I’m curious if that’s something Netflix would want us to continue or change.
You could push the episodes to 40 minutes, or 30-something.
That would be good. Look, I’m always a fan of longer. I always get accused of needing to trim my scenes down. I always over write.
Adam Brody spoke to us about how much prep work he did to play a rabbi, and how seriously he took this role. And Kristen had her hand in this show from the start; as I understand you initially envisioned this role for yourself but then gave her your blessing when Netflix brought this to her. What have their reactions been around the response to the show?
Adam is a very offline person, which is honestly so annoying. Because I’m like, “I need you to be seeing these memes about you.” We literally created a fake Twitter account for him just so he could go on Twitter and see, and he’s like, “No, I can’t.” He’s too mentally healthy to allow himself to go into these dark holes. And, I respect it. And Kristen came into the room this week with Justine to hear some storylines that we were working on. She says she hasn’t gotten a reaction to anything like this, literally, since Frozen. It’s crazy. They’re just so happy, of course. They are perfect in these roles.
And you didn’t even chemistry test them.
No! It was a huge risk. I was like, “What if these guys don’t vibe on camera?” And then we watched on camera and we were like, “Are they having an affair? This is steamy!”
Can you share what you have in store for their onscreen siblings, Sasha [Simmons] and Morgan [Lupe], in season two?
I think we’re going to wrap up their weird “Is it romantic?” thing. Because we want to see them together in season two, hanging out. We want to see Esther. I think we went down that road enough that now we’re going to pull back and reposition so we can have them all in scenes together without [Morgan] being like, a full homewrecker. But we’re going to give Morgan something very fun. Justine came in and we pitched it to her and she was like, “This is my dream storyline.” It’s so fun.
Since you are working on season two, could it come out sooner than a year from now?
No. It takes so much longer than you would ever think. It’s basically going to be coming back, probably, in September again next year. Once a year, the same time, we’ll be really consistent. We’re just going to be a Rosh Hashanah launch, always (laughs).
And, I was wondering, did one of your writers really have a “So-and-So Takes a Bite Out of the Big Apple” as their bar or bat mitzvah theme?
Oh my God, yes. There was a writer who worked on the show early on and her husband had that as his bar mitzvah theme. I think his grandmother forced it on him and we were like — that’s so funny, we have to use that. It’s funny, the things that survive throughout the show, and that this still ended up being the exact thing we did. Because usually, when you pitch something early on, someone beats it. It becomes something else or something better. But that one was just the best.
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Nobody Wants This is now streaming all episodes on Netflix.
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