James Franco on New Movie ‘Hey Joe,’ Being ‘Grateful’ for His Fall From Grace and the End of Seth Rogen Friendship: ‘I Guess It’s Over’
James Franco is tucked away in the corner of a five-star hotel lobby on Rome’s Via Veneto, sipping an Americano coffee. Wearing a chocolate brown hoodie he proudly says he co-designed, the actor and filmmaker looks relaxed and flashes his signature smile.
He’s in the Eternal City for the Rome Film Festival launch of Italian director Claudio Giovannesi’s “Hey Joe.” In the gritty drama, Franco plays Dean, an alcoholic American WWII vet who winds up back in Naples in the early ’70s in search of a son he fathered there before absconding to New Jersey.
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The film is his first to surface on the fest circuit since his career went on hiatus following a now-settled 2019 lawsuit alleging that he sexually exploited young women who took his acting class. As he sips his coffee, Franco and I agree that his character is looking for redemption. Could the same be said of Franco?
After becoming one of Hollywood’s hottest stars with a range of roles including Sam Raimi’s “Spider-Man” trilogy, Harmony Korine’s “Spring Breakers,” stoner comedies with Seth Rogen such as “Pineapple Express” and Danny Boyle’s “127 Hours” – for which he scored an Oscar nomination – Franco’s career pretty much ground to a halt after the lawsuit. It likely also cost him his second Oscar nomination after winning the best actor Golden Globe for 2018’s “The Disaster Artist,” which he also directed.
On “The Jess Cagle” podcast in December 2021, Franco admitted to sleeping with students at his acting school, saying “that was wrong” but “it wasn’t a master plan on my part.” Still, he was cast out of Hollywood, with his first movie to hit the screen since 2019 being this year’s French thriller “The Price of Money: A Largo Winch Adventure” — which came out in France in July but has no U.S. release plans.
But these days, Franco is thankful for his fall from grace.
“Being told you’re bad is painful,” he says. “But ultimately, that’s kind of what I needed to just stop going the way I was going.”
Recently, he’s been drawing inspiration from the self-help book “The Second Mountain,” by New York Times columnist David Brooks, which preaches that one can’t find midlife satisfaction until committing to a cause larger than oneself. “From everything I’ve read, it seems like that’s the more fulfilling life,” he says calmly. He’s also been drawing and painting a lot, and recently launched a Hollywood streetwear fashion label that he co-founded with longtime friend Kyle Lindgren. But what about his movie career?
Well, aside from “Hey Joe” and “The Price of Money,” Franco recently reunited with Tommy Lee Jones on U.S. action thriller “The Razor’s Edge” (now in post-production). However, “Alina of Cuba” — based on a book by Fidel Castro’s daughter, who asked him to star on the film as the communist leader — has apparently stalled. “I honestly don’t know what’s happening with that release,” he says. He also recently shot a serial killer thriller in Portland with Vincent Gallo titled “The Policeman,” for which Gallo came under fire for making lewd comments to the actors during the audition process. Now, Franco says “there is fighting over the cut” so he doesn’t know what’s going to happen with that, either. And, the Bille August-directed drama “Me, You” — in which he was supposed to star opposite Tom Hollander and Daisy Jacob — “fell apart on both of us,” he notes glumly.
During a candid one-hour conversation, Franco spoke to Variety about contending with the fallout from his sexual misconduct lawsuit, his joy at being in a long-term relationship with actress-director Izabel Pakzad, wanting to direct again and falling out with Seth Rogen.
How did “Hey Joe” come to be?
The movie was actually kind of a gift out of the sky. I’ve loved European cinema for a long time, and I’d seen Claudio’s movies before this offer. And I’d met the writer, Maurizio Braucci, through another director named Pietro Marcello [“Martin Eden”]. And then out of the blue, I got this offer.
I was like, “Oh, I like this. I like the redemption idea.” And then I love Italian cinema, in particular Claudio’s movies. So it was a very easy yes. I’m telling you, when I saw it: “Claudio Giovannesi, director of ‘Piranhas’; “Hey Joe,” the title. I play an American in an Italian film. I couldn’t have asked for more. And then I read the script and it was great.
You speak Italian in the film, and I know over the years you’ve been to Italy quite a bit. I remember at one point you were very close to [Gucci’s former creative director] Frida Giannini and you did a lot of Gucci stuff, including a Gucci doc. So I’m just wondering where the Italian came from — did you have to study or did you already know it?
No, I didn’t. When I was working with Gucci, I maybe could have learned it then. But I’d come to Italy once a year back then, so I think I was just too busy with other things. I wish I had learned it back then. But yeah, I really started learning [Italian] on this one. Now, I still can’t really speak it, but when I have a coach and I’m playing an American that is not too good at it, then I think I can do a good job. It was a whole different experience; it was the first time I’d ever acted in a film in a language other than English.
This and other recent roles, like the one you have in the latest “Largo Winch Adventure,” mark your return to acting following a roughly four-year hiatus. But they are both European productions — how does it feel to be back and do you feel you were basically “canceled” in the U.S.?
I’m so grateful to be working. I did go through a lawsuit, and during that lawsuit I wasn’t working. But then COVID hit so everybody wasn’t working. So, I don’t know, it was all… I mean, we were all kind of in it. So it was sort of like, “I don’t know what I am.”
But I did certainly use the time to, I hope, good purpose. And whatever had been going on with me before, I had to change my whole way of life. So I am proud of the kind of work I did during that time. And yeah, I wasn’t working in movies, but I certainly was doing a lot of work to change who I was.
Up until, let’s say the past eight years [before the hiatus] I had a good career. But it was very hard for me to enjoy it. I was a workaholic; I was going all the time. And even when there were good moments – like a movie that people liked or, I don’t know, [being] nominated for an award or whatever it might be, whatever good moments along the way that I wish I could have appreciated – I just didn’t because I had this weird thing where it was just like, I always need more.
So how are things different now?
So now, after having the pause and, I think, changing priorities, I guess what I seek to fulfill me in life [is different]. Ultimately, I think I’m kind of grateful because it did afford me a chance to just do whatever private work and really change what I need to change. So now that I am working, I can just be there for the project. It’s not about me trying to fill some hole with work, it’s just about, “Wow, I have a really great life. I’m very grateful, and I hope to serve whatever project I do.”
Do you feel that your being cast out of Hollywood was unfair?
I mean, it is what it is. I’ve honestly moved past it. It was dealt with, and I got to change. So that’s it, it’s over. I mean, I’ve worked in the U.S. too. So I’m just trying to move on.
Speaking of that kind of frenzied wish for gratification and fulfillment from your work, how did you feel when, after the accusations, you were basically snubbed for the best actor nomination for “The Disaster Artist”?
What I’ve really found is… I don’t want it to sound like platitudes, but honestly, this is my experience. Sometimes life delivers things to you, and the delivery system is so painful. It really hurts. Yeah, I felt really proud of that performance in “The Disaster Artist.” And OK, I wasn’t nominated. Yeah, that hurt. But ultimately, from the big picture that I’m talking about, maybe it’s for the best. Who am I to say? When I was functioning in that workaholic mode, a lot of it was just my young self’s version of what a good life was. And I got pulled out of that.
So what is the older version of yourself like?
There’s a great book I like called “The Second Mountain.” And basically, it talks about how the first mountain is all our dreams when we’re young and we’re trying to achieve that. Some people stay on the first mountain for their whole lives. But some people are thrown off, and you can either try and get back on that first mountain or you could go to the second mountain. And the second mountain is a more kind of spiritually-oriented life, a life that is more kind of service-oriented, thinking about the bigger picture, thinking about others. And from everything I’ve read, from all kinds of thinkers and writers and whatever, it seems like that’s the more fulfilling life. And so as painful as it was — yes, of course rejection is painful, being told you’re bad is painful. But ultimately that’s kind of what I needed to just stop going the way I was going.
How has this way of thinking changed your life?
I mean, I’ve been in recovery for a long time, since I was a teenager. And I never had any sort of relapse on substances, but I certainly had strayed away from a kind of regular engagement with my recovery. And so a term for that is dry — like emotionally dry, spiritually dry. And so I think that’s what I was.
And so now I just made it a huge priority in my life to just stay engaged, give back. It’s a large part of what I’ve been doing, frankly, and it’s given me a lot of relief. And I don’t like to talk about it too much because it’s sort of like you get one or the other: you get the credit or you get the relief. So if you go around and just keep talking about all the good things you’re doing, you kind of don’t get the relief of doing that work. So I haven’t really talked about it too much or promoted it or anything, I don’t have social media. But that is a big part of my life now.
I mean, I really didn’t have a personal life. I had friends, but it was always sort of enmeshed with my work. And so, yeah, I put a lot of time into my personal life. I’ve had a relationship for seven-and-a-half years [with U.S. actress-director Izabel Pakzad]. I was never able to do that before. I was just too scared, really … to have any sort of real intimacy with anyone.
Do you have the itch to go back to directing?
I love directing. But I think one thing that I’ve learned is just patience and to understand when the time is right that right things will come to you. My young brain sometimes will come in and say, “But I want this and I want it now!” And what I’ve learned is I don’t know what’s on the other side of that. There might be something else that I can’t see that is so much better. So honestly – and I’m sorry if this sounds like platitudes – but it’s really how I’m trying to live my life. I love directing, I would love to direct. I think it’ll happen when the time is right.
Are you still in touch with Seth Rogen?
No. I haven’t talked to Seth. I love Seth, we had 20 great years together, but I guess it’s over. And not for lack of trying. I’ve told him how much he’s meant to me.
This interview has been edited and condensed for clarity.
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